Navigating Conflict and Triggers
In one of our first podcast episodes, Jennifer Hargrave engaged in a thought-provoking conversation with Kim Griffith. Kim is an executive coach and life coach. They sat down and discussed the complexities of conflict management and the profound impact that triggers have in relationships.
Understanding Conflict at its Core
Jennifer Hargrave:
Thank you so much for coming. I want to start off because one of the things that I’ve learned a lot from you is how to manage conflict and how to manage our own triggers. I want to start off and ask you to give us a definition and overview, what is conflict?
Causes of Conflict: Communication Struggles
Kim Griffith:
Well, what causes conflict is when we are struggling to communicate what we want, what’s important to us, what we need, and what’s a yes and a no. When we cannot communicate that in a calm, confident, clear way to give the other person the best chance to respond in a calm way, it just causes so much conflict.
The Role of Triggers in Conflict
What is a trigger? What role do triggers play in conflicting relationships?
Kim:
Trigger’s kind of a word right now that a lot of people are using and they laugh about it, but it really is something. A trigger is when something in the environment, whether it’s a look on someone’s face, word, smell, sound, it can be anything in the environment that sets off almost like a flashback, and it transports us back into a time where we were treated in a certain way that we got disconnected with, we felt not safe. It literally puts our brain and body into a place of disconnect and fight, flight, and freeze.
We start reacting in this way that is just crazy. It’s because we didn’t get to work through it at the time that it happened. It could be something small or big, but when that happens, we what we’re really needing is connection and to be able to work through it. What happens is, later on in life something happens, whether a look, conversation, or something happens, and it literally puts our lower part of the brain into fight, flight, and freeze.
This is why people don’t realize like they want to show up in a certain way, they may want to say something, but they don’t show up in that way because they’re literally, and I always show people this because it really helped me. It’s like I always do this hand model and Daniel Siegel is the one who created this. I think it helps because when we’re triggered like that, imagine this is your brain. This is the lower part of the brain where this is fight, flight and freeze. This is the top part of the brain, the neocortex, where we’re rational, and we can think straight, problem solving, and making good decisions that actually move us forward and help us get what we want. Something happens, whether that is that look, something that happens, or somebody says something in a certain way. Literally, when this part of the brain is online, we’re good. What happens is, we get triggered and it says, “I’m not safe. I’m not okay, I’m not safe,” even if it’s a perceived threat. Our lid is actually flipped. We’re literally walking around like- and we go into this place and fight, flight and freeze, whether we fight, shutdown, want to get out, which we all know what that’s like.
That’s what’s happening when we’re getting triggered. Our lid is flipped and we’re not able to show up and communicate, and make decisions the way we really want to.
Jennifer:
That’s for the saying, “She flipped her lid,” came from?
Kim:
That is exactly where it comes from, seriously.
What is the ‘amygdala hijack?’
Jennifer:
Interesting. I’ve heard another term, I think this is the same thing called the “amygdala hijack.”
Is that the same?
Kim:
Same thing.
Jennifer:
Where that amygdala part of the brain is regulating and it takes over. It”s like a bear is chasing us, right?
Kim:
It is. You know, it’s okay to have this lower part of the brain when a bear is chasing us. That’s good, but we don’t want to walk around with our spouse, kids, employees, or team with our lid flipped. It wreaks havoc on our emotional well-being, our physical well-being. Most people really are walking around in this place. My message is to help people bring back that connection because we’re hardwired for connection.
Connection is being seen, heard, and valued. When those things happen to us, it’s nobody’s fault. We didn’t get what we needed, period. Connection to work through a challenge is the deal. We’re hardwired for it; we need it, and so often, don’t get it.
Jennifer:
One of the things that I found really interesting is that my adult brain thinks that I am a logical, rational person that I know why things make me angry, and yet in the moment of anger these are really not rational things that are flipping my lid. I don’t really know or understand why it’s happening.
Explain the work that you do with people in unpacking what the source of those triggers are.
Unpacking Triggers: The WAVE Process
Working Through Triggers: Witness, Accept, Validate, Empower
Kim:
Okay. It is because you almost can’t control it. When you’re in fight, flight, and freeze and your lid is flipped, it takes what I help people learn to do to actually get back into that calm place. What’s really happening is these beliefs are kicked in. We create these parts of us. When we’ve had some trauma and we’ve had things that we didn’t work through, we actually create parts of us that believe that we are not something enough. We’re not good enough, hurt enough, or seen enough. We’re not pretty enough, or whatever. We create these beliefs and we don’t want to feel that. We don’t want to experience that so we cover it up and manage. We create parts of us that are people pleasers, or we’re the victim. It’s not all bad, but when those parts of us get turned up, they actually end up creating the feeling of not good enough and all of that. It is absolutely uncontrollable. We don’t see it and it takes reconnecting becoming aware of these patterns and these beliefs, and these parts of us. Work with them, give them what they need, and that is what I do with people.
Ending Conflict: Finding Win-Win Solutions
Jennifer:
What’s so fascinating to me is that what we’re really wanting is connection, yet our repeating pattern and behavior drives us to disconnection, right? When you’re in that triggered state, you’re not connecting.
Kim:
No, you are not connecting and you’re just operating from this reactive place that’s trying not to feel some of these disowned parts of you. We all have them; this is normal. This is the human experience. I really love to help people understand that we’re not broken; there’s nothing wrong. These parts of us will absolutely get in our way from creating what we want, whether that’s in our business, a divorce, handling it the way you really want to. They wreak havoc, they run the show no matter if you are saying the right thing. A lot of things out there teach you how to communicate, but what’s happening is the energy of these patterns are running. They’re running the show and they’re like a magnet.
When you’re trying to say the right thing, the energy of the pattern is actually running the show more than your words. The other person is going to react to it because they have their own triggers. Now you’re in trigger land and there’s no win-win solution; there’s no moving forward.
Jennifer:
What is the anecdote to this situation? How do we better learn to manage these triggers? I guess the art of it is to manage them before they happen because it sounds like once you’re in the triggered state, there’s not a whole lot you can do. We’ll talk about that. How do you manage the situation so that you can show show up in a way that actually brings connection into your life?
Kim:
You actually have to work with your trigger first. When something’s happening and somebody says something, a situation, or challenge occurs, you really have to learn to connect to you and your trigger, and take full responsibility of your trigger.
Yesterday, I was working with a client and they were telling me this exact situation that happened. They were justified and their anger and frustration, and they’re like, “they”, and then point. I get it. The behavior of someone else might need addressing. It might need to have some boundaries, but first, if you really want to end up with a higher solution and stay connected, even if you have to set a boundary, you have to work with your own trigger first. That is what I found my personal journey was that I tried all of this.
I had my Master’s degree in Transpersonal Psychology. I tried so many things out there and I was still in conflict. I was still struggling with my daughter, my husband at the time, and I couldn’t move my business forward, the way I wanted. I was just still struggling and I was like, “No, I want the real solution here. I do not want to keep doing the same thing over, bypassing this stuff, trying to show up in the way I want, and trying to get what I want.
I dug deep and that’s when I created The WAVE Process, that is a coaching and communication tool that helps you bring back that connection that we all want. It’s within you, reconnecting to yourself, learning how to communicate and staying connected with someone else, and also connecting.
I talked about the 3 levels of connection, and that is also connecting to that higher, something greater. I don’t care what you call it. I have found that connecting to whether it’s God or energy, allowing that connection helps us stay connected, ground, calm, and being able to work through these triggers.
The WAVE Process actually helps you look at the trigger, see the trigger, see the part of you and connect, accept and validate that part, and help you give it what it needs so you can communicate.
Jennifer:
I love that. Can you give us an overview of what The WAVE Process is?
Kim:
It’s my favorite subject. I didn’t know what I was creating when I created, but what I realize is what I was doing is the WAVE is witness, accept, validate, and empower.
Witnessing is learning to step outside of your emotional reaction, which is not always easy, I get it, but learning to build the skill of witnessing is huge. It’s awareness, mindfulness, that’s what everybody talks about. Stepping outside your emotional reaction, watching with curiosity and non-judgement, and what you’re thinking, feeling, and doing, is it working? Is it not?
Jennifer:
I just want to respond to you because I’ve worked with you on this. I have studied this process and I’ve used it. I’m going to say, I think this simple act of witnessing yourself in that moment is in and of itself, a tool for de-escalating the conflict. Even if you don’t even move anywhere past that, but just that simple act of going, “Oh, here I go again. I’m feeling like the bear’s chasing me and it’s just my teenager who won’t get out of bed,” just being aware in that moment and taking that.
Kim:
It is the deal. It is the foundation. As soon as you take responsibility for your trigger, even if you do need to set a boundary or ask for something different, if you don’t take that self-responsibility for the trigger, nothing changes. Nothing goes well, usually.
Jennifer:
But you repeat the same things over again. You feel like you’re hitting your head against a wall and you’re in the same pattern of relationships and dynamics.
Kim:
It may look a little different, but it’s the same pattern.
Jennifer:
That person may have a different name, they may have a different body build, but it is the same energy between the two of you. So what’s the next step?
Kim:
Before we move on, witnessing your own trigger, taking responsibility, and see if you can work through that, you’ll get a glimpse of it as we go forward, that’s step one.
Step two is looking at the other person and catching when they’re triggered. “Wow. Okay, they’re triggered.” You can see it from their body language, the way they’re speaking, are they shutting down? Are they angry? You can learn to pick that up and get curious. “Oh, okay, they’re triggered.”
Jennifer:
So on that note, is it or is it not true that triggers are actually contagious?
Kim:
I haven’t really thought about it like that, but yes, they are contagious because if you’re triggered, I can guarantee you, you’re going to most likely trigger the other person. It is contagious and then here you go, you’re in the dance, right?
Jennifer:
The conflict is escalating and the disconnection is growing.
Kim:
Absolutely. So, yes, it is contagious. Learning to watch somebody else and pick that up, you can’t do that very well if you’re in a constant state of trigger. The more we’ve had trauma, the more we’re going to be triggered. It’s that simple. I think we can just acknowledge that.
Jennifer:
I want to touch on something real quick there because trauma, we often times think of significant trauma that maybe makes the news. The abuse, loss of a parent, a horrific accident, or something big, but the truth is, in our lives, when were that little five-year-old kid, the traumatic event is not necessarily something we look at as an adult and think, “Oh, that’s traumatic.”
Kim:
Absolutely not. I think this is what we’re starting to understand now. It isn’t these big traumas. For example, if you get a message over and over that when you try to speak or talk in your environment, parents, or people who are around you and they constantly degrade what you’re saying or shut you down, that repeated act, just that repeated disconnect, it will absolutely create a belief that you’re not heard. You may not be conscious of that belief, but then later on, when you’re in an environment where you’re working, your boss, all of a sudden shows up like your parents and they’re not listening, or you’re getting a divorce, you’re not being heard, and you really aren’t being hurt, you’re going to get so triggered.
It doesn’t have to be this huge traumatic event. It can be a repeated messaging where you’re not valued, seen, and heard. This is what we know about connection now. It doesn’t have to be a huge event.
Jennifer:
It’s not just our family of origin, but it could be those difficult years on the playground in the early days, right?
Kim:
School. If you keep me going on, how much time do we have? personally believe it causes what we call “secondary trauma”. I have a nonprofit that is all about education. It is a deal. The environment is not set up, usually, to handle conflict, really help both parties grow and learn from that conflict, watching how these kids are getting triggered and the teacher is triggered, and how to actually work through that and create some safety, then learn how to be resilient to conflict, we don’t do that.
Jennifer:
No, we don’t. We don’t talk about resiliency and conflict.
Kim:
And then you get all these traumas later from school.
Jennifer:
All right, so that’s W. Let’s go to the A.
Kim:
Acceptance. This is often so hard because acceptance of the part of us that is getting triggered, accepting what we’re thinking, feeling, and doing, being able to let that part of us express, not in a destructive way, but in a way that actually allows that part to be seen and heard, letting it out whether it’s with some coach or somebody who can actually hold space, and allowing it to be seen, that’s huge. Even if it’s not rational, even if you want it to change, accepting it first, allowing it to be there, because what we’re always doing is not wanting to accept it, we want to keep blaming and go outward with what we’re feeling and what we’re experiencing. It’s uncomfortable, right?
When you’re working with somebody else, actually accepting, you may not like it. You may not think they’re being rational, but just listening and hearing them and is so important. As soon as you don’t do that, you’re disconnected and in a turner.
Jennifer:
Absolutely. I think that the big part when you’re the one who’s holding that space for somebody else to set aside judgment and just be there with them in that time and let them feel and know that they are in a safe place is tremendously helpful. I think something these days, we’re not really good at doing. I think everybody’s quick to judgment.
Kim:
That’s for sure right? Yes.
Jennifer:
All right. Tell us about the V.
Kim: Validation. It is such a huge piece of connection. Acceptance and validation is huge, and really validating ourselves, giving some heartfelt compassion and understanding of why we might be showing up, acting, feeling, thinking the way we are. This is where the process goes a little deeper in during coaching and helping work with some of these parts of us a little deeper, sometimes you need to do that, actually validating ourselves, giving some genuine connection to ourselves, and having that heartfelt connection and understanding why we’re doing it. You don’t always have to know why, but just really giving some compassion and understanding, and then the same with someone else.
Validating someone else when they’re doing whatever they’re doing, you can validate what they’re saying and hearing. Give some heartfelt compassion to it. You cannot do that if you’re really triggered, that’s why it’s a dance between working through your own trigger to stay in higher brain. You can actually validate somebody else’s reality even if you don’t agree because as soon as you do, they’re going to come off the trigger. That’s where you want to be before you can get to a solution, even if you think they’re crazy and they’re just off, which they are when they’re in the trigger, or somebody has a belief in a certain way. Truly validating them where they energetically feel seen, heard, and valued, you’re going to really bring it down. Both people are going to come back online, so validation is huge.
You can see this in kids and anybody, but really with kids. When they feel seen and heard even if they don’t get their way, they tend to come off the trigger.
Jennifer:
I love that you mentioned compassion. It seems like it’s easier to have compassion for other people, but so challenging to give that same compassion to ourselves. I’m really glad you mentioned that because I think it’s such a key part of our humanity and existence, having that compassion.
Kim:
That is so true. I absolutely believe we are in an epidemic of disconnection and not valuing ourselves. It comes from our lack of connection, growing up in our different systems and environments, and some of the trauma. It is an epidemic, and bringing back connection and self-value for ourselves and not always looking outward for it, wanting somebody else to hear us and say, “Yes, we want that,” but our self-value has to come from within. It is not something we’re taught. It’s not model, and we are just now starting to learn the importance of it.
Jennifer:
Love that. Finally, we have the E.
Kim:
Yes. During validation though, we have to learn to give yourself what you need, what we didn’t get back then, learn how to give ourselves what we need, and ask for it from other people. Really, it has to come from here, and learning what other people really are needing when you’re talking to them. What are they really needing? Get curious.
The empowerment is showing up, “How do I want to show up? What would be the new way that I want to think and believe, and see things that’s more in alignment with my higher self?” It’s really stepping into that new reference instead of the old belief and showing up, it’s really building the new reference of how you want to think and feel. It becomes easier to do when you witness, accept, and validate these parts. They naturally start to move. You naturally move more into that empowerment.
Jennifer:
What you begin to see are those areas in your life like little baby steps, where you are showing up in the way that you want to show up. The more reference points you have, the easier it is to begin to create the kind of relationships that you want to have.
Kim:
Yes, because when you stay online and you’re working through the trigger, then you can find the win-win. With what you do, it’s so big. You walk through a divorce, you want to be able as much as possible, you and I’ve talked about this, and I personally have experienced it and you partnered with me to walk through it, a divorce, it’s going to bring up so much.
Jennifer:
It’s a moment of fear. You don’t know what the future is going to look like, you’re losing your identity. That’s one of the things that we’ve talked about on the previous shows, how important that identity is. When you lose that identity, that’s an incredible moment of fear. It’s your financial uncertainty, all those things, your relationship with your children. Everything that’s most important to you is on the line when you’re in a divorce. You’re exactly right. It is a time when people are very triggered.
Kim:
Very. You’re not going to get away from that. If you can learn and you’re committed to walking through a divorce, or in your business, you’re creating an environment of connection and empowerment, if you’re committed to that and you understand the power of it and what it will give you, and the people around you, it is easier to stay committed and pay attention to when you’re triggered and learn how to work through that before you’re communicating and asking for what you’re wanting and needing.
Jennifer:
Not only that, but I think, in my experience, that’s actually how you get what you need in the divorce, to look at this period of time as a time of growth and transition, and to stay focused on what it is that you want to create in that next chapter, and not get lost in the blaming because that’s where people are disempowered.
Kim:
Yes, and you’re just playing out and repeating the patterns, that you
don’t even know you don’t really want, because that’s what you’re used to, that’s what you know and you’re just doing it. If people could understand, my passion is to help people see what’s possible. When you when you work through these triggers, you might work through a trick, work on yourself, and then the other person is just not capable, if one person in the situation can operate from this higher place, things are going to go better. You’re going to find the win-win, right? Some of it is just knowing, what do you really want, what is important, and being able to find that win-win and communicate it clearly, you get to the other side and you get to free up so much energy.
All this conflict hurts everyone around you. It creates such a negative environment. I see it in businesses all the time, people who are very successful, the environment is not successful and it’s not fun. People aren’t motivated. It’s not a great environment situation, whether you’re going through a divorce.
Jennifer:
That’s why I love The WAVE Process, because I’ve seen how it works in the context of a divorce frequently, because that’s the world in which I live. I’ve also seen how it can work in my own family life with my husband and with children. We know it works in the business world. It applies to everywhere we have human relationships. It applies because this is about how we are showing up. If you want to build a life where you are connected with the other people, this is such a great tool.
I’m so happy you have given some time today to come talk about it and share it with us. If people want to learn more about The WAVE Process and about you, Kim, where can they find out about that?
Kim:
You can go to thewaveprocess.com. That’s my website. All the information is there to connect with me. We can talk about how the WAVE would bess fit your situation.
Tools for empowering yourself during a divorce
Jennifer:
That’s great. I think it’s a tremendous tool. If somebody is thinking about divorce, it’s a great tool to have, to use.
I have one question that I want us to end on. You did recently go through divorce.
Kim:
Yes, I did. I couldn’t even imagine that a divorce could go like that. It’s so great.
Jennifer:
What I want to ask you is, if you could go back and tell yourself, the Kim who was facing a divorce, thinking about divorce, and weighing the decision to divorce, if you could go back and tell yourself anything, what would you tell yourself
Kim:
You’re going to get to the other side and all the fear and emotions, you’re going to get what you need to get, and the support will come to you as you go through it. You don’t have to know everything, you don’t have to see the other side right away, just trust that you’re going to get, whether it’s from your group or law firm, because that was so much of it, getting that support, but kinds of support came to me as I needed it. That was so huge. I didn’t realize that that could happen. I wanted to know everything right away before I walked through. I would say, “Trust you’re going to get what you need, Kim, as you go along. This decision is so empowering. You’re going to open up a whole new you. You’re going to live that life that you’re really in alignment with. You’re going to create something so great,” and stay connected to my ex. We’re still friends; we’re still good. My child has come through it very well because we pretty much stay connected even through challenge.
Jennifer:
I love that. Thank you again. It’s great having you.
Kim:
Thank you so much. I appreciate it.
Jennifer:
Thank you so much for joining us. Until next time, we’ll see you then.
